Dr. Magda Havas: Citizen Scientists Can Make a Difference When It Comes to 5G and COVID-19

Magda Havas began research on acid rain and metal pollution in 1975 and worked at the Smoking Hills in the Canadian arctic, in Ontario near the INCO and Falconbridge metal smelters, and at Hubbard Brook in New Hampshire. She was Science Advisor to the Canadian Coalition on Acid Rain and her research (and that of others) helped bring in clean air legislation (Eastern Canadian Acid Rain Program) in 1985 that reduced sulphur dioxide emissions by 30% and lead to improvements in air and water quality and ultimately resulted in the recovery of lakes, which she also studied. Her paper “Red Herrings in Acid Rain Research” confronted the misconceptions that were being perpetrated about acid rain and its effects.

Magda gave two presentations to us on April 14, 2022, entitled: Citizen scientists can make a difference when it comes to 5g and 5g and COVID, is there a connection?

This is an edited segment from the weekly live General Assembly meeting on April 14, 2022. This presentation is also available on Rumble and Odysee. The full General Assembly Meeting is available in the Newsroom. A transcript of this presentation can be found below.

[00:00:00] [00:00:30] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: Now I would like to introduce our next speaker. Dr. Magda Havas. She is a PhD and professor Emeritis. She is founder and director of The Rose Lab that deals with research of subtle energy. Her title of her talk today is ‘Citizen scientists can make a difference when it comes to 5G’. [00:00:51] Magda, please, we really look forward to hearing what you have to share with us today. [00:00:55] Dr. Magda Havas: Thank you very much, Jennifer. [00:00:57] What I’m going to do is I’m going to be sharing with you some of the research that we’ve been doing with citizens from all over the world and I’m going to be talking that’s the citizen scientists can make a difference when it comes to 5g. [00:01:12] The other talk I’m giving is ‘5g and COVID, is there a connection? [00:01:17] Back in 2002, I started doing monitoring of electric and magnetic fields in different communities here in Ontario, where I live and I decided I wanted to make it accessible to a lot of people. And so I came up with something that we use here as a color code , and I use four different colors, black, red, amber, green. They’re in black and white here, because it was too expensive to print them in color for the publication. [00:01:45] But you can see here that when something is black it means the levels are very high. Compared to something like here in Niagara falls where the levels would be much lower. So that was one of the studies that we did. We did another study called ‘Can you brag about your school?’ And in this particular study, we looked at schools in the United States and in the capital cities of each state and we ranked the schools based on three different criteria: The nearest tower antenna to the school; the number of antennas within a quarter mile and the number of antennas within 0.6 miles. Those with the three different criteria were used and we use miles because it was American. And here you can see that Richmond, Virginia was the best. The most antennas within a 0.6 miles, which is one kilometer was 16. And then if you go down to the bottom here, Boston 51, there were 749 antennas within a 0.6 miles of schools, which is absolutely absurd. And so we, we did this publication and showed other people how to do it as well. And it’s available on our website. [00:03:06] And those two studies gave me the idea back in February of last year and I was sitting at home you know, with the lockdown of COVID and I was really getting more and more upset with our government. Governments set guidelines, but they don’t actually measure guidelines. And so it’s like having a speed limit on the highway with no traffic cops. And I was wondering how we could get information on what levels were in communities. [00:03:37] And the concept came to me that we could actually use volunteers to do this. And so in March of 2021, we sent out invitations by an email that Angela Tsiang hosts, asking for volunteers. We asked them if they have the safe and sound pro meter, which is the meter that we were using. We were able to get a discount for the company, for anyone who wanted to buy the meter. [00:04:04] And by the end of March, we had 140 volunteers from 13 countries, which is much better than I had anticipated. We started the sampling in April of 2021. And we ended up sampling 206 sites within one month, which is also amazing. And this April is our first anniversary. Currently we have 400 volunteers from 21 countries who are monitoring radio frequency radiation in different communities. [00:04:38] We have a number of projects that we started, the first one was; ‘Can you BRAG about your city’, which is what we started with in April of last year. We have another one that we call 6, 30, 24, where we were measuring the duration of monitoring. Health Canada recommends six minutes. The Federal communication commission in the US rec recommends 30 minute testing and we’re exposed 24 hours. [00:05:06] So we wanted to find out how accurate the six and 30 minute were, representing our 24 hour exposure. Our third project was ‘Can you BRAG about your microwave oven?’, which we started this month. Most microwave ovens leak. And the next project we’re working on is; ‘Can you BRAG about your car?’, because cars are becoming more and more with wireless technology and people simply cannot drive them, it makes them sick. [00:05:32] So we’ve got a number of studies that are ongoing and I’d like to focus on, ‘Can you BRAG about your city?’, which is what we’re talking about today. We’ve set up a website it’s called global emf.net, which you can see here in the right-hand corner. And the very first month, these are the results that we got. [00:05:53] And what you can do is you can zoom in on this map and get closer and closer. And you can zoom in on one of the particular sites and it’ll give you information about what streets were monitored and what the actual readings were. And in some cases you can get pictures of the streets that are being monitored as well. [00:06:12] So we set this up about a year ago and we’re not looking back, we’re still doing studies. And basically what we did is we asked people to go to the downtown core, of a community nearby, or maybe the community they live in and measure five intersections in a row at all four corners. And then we took that information and converted it into these three concentric circles. [00:06:39] And those three circles represent the average for that street, the median value and the maximum value. And the colors are from a traffic light. So we used green, amber, red with green being the lowest, and then we added another one black for very high readings. And so if you look at this, you don’t have to worry about numbers or anything, you can see that this is a fairly polluted environment. It’s got black, it’s got red, it’s got amber, so the levels are really quite high. [00:07:14] We then also associated numbers with the four green, amber, red, black and this is what they end up looking like. And so very low is all green, less than a thousand micro Watts per meter squared and then you can see here that it gets very high, very, very quickly. And this is what the map looks like currently, you can see we’ve got data from quite a few different countries and we’re getting more and more people volunteering each time, and anyone can go to this map it’s available, you can zoom in, you can put in addresses to see if anyone’s actually done that kind of monitoring. [00:07:55] And when we talk about the lowest and highest exposures, this is what we got for the various countries these are the very low exposures and down at the bottom, we have the cities with the highest exposures. And you can see here that in Australia, Melbourne is really quite high in Brazil Sao Paulo very high in Denver, Colorado is very high and even Montpellier in Vermont is quite high and that’s just a small state that doesn’t seem to have a very high population, so I was surprised to get that high reading at the bottom here. [00:08:33] So one of the questions we wanted to find out was 5G and COVID, is there a connection? And can we monitor the levels to find out what the levels are on city streets? And so we took the data and here we have 4G data, then we have 4G LTE plus 5G, and then we have 4G LTE plus 5G plus millimeter wave technology. [00:09:01] And what we have here in the three graphs are population along the x-axis and intensity of the radio frequency along the Y axis. And you can see here, I’ve provided the US guidelines, the Russian guidelines and the Salzburg guidelines. And I’ve super imposed on these graphs, the green, amber, red and black, so you can see what categories they all fit into. [00:09:28] And I think, you know, the way to compare these data is if you look at all the averages and you can see here that the averages, once millimeter waves come in, it begins to get up into the red part of the spectrum for averages begins to approach the black for the medium values and goes well into the black, for the maximum values. [00:09:51] The other thing you can see from this graph is that the 5g millimeter wave technology is introduced primarily into larger communities. So smaller communities don’t yet have the 5g, as of this, the date of this particular sampling. We also have the sample size, so we had 44 communities in the 4g LTE, 95 communities, and then 29 communities. [00:10:18] And here we have simply the breakdown of the communities, whether they sit into a red, amber, green type of module. And so you can see here, if you simply follow the red 9% here falls into the red part of the spectrum, whereas 18% when you introduce 5g without the millimeter waves. And now we have a huge amount going into the very high and the high, once the millimeter waves are introduced. [00:10:46] Now, the technology that we used we were unable to measure the millimeter wave part of the spectrum, but as everyone knows on this call, that 5g actually consists of three different frequency bands, two of which are less than six gigahertz. So we were measuring those bands, but not the millimeter bands. [00:11:07] And then Verizon came to our support and did something very interesting. They decided to show where their 5g millimeter waves are and what they do is they call this 5g ultra wide band. And on this map, you can see here that if you go to this particular website verizon.com you can then put in an address and zero in on the community that you’re looking at. [00:11:36] And so what we did is we had people in New York who were monitoring for us, and we asked them if they would go and monitor two parallel streets, one of which had 5g and you can see it here, this is this millimeter waves being available. And here we 6th Avenue where there’s no 5g ultra wide band. [00:11:59] And so basically what they did is took five different intersections, measured the radiation here and measured the radiation here. And this is what they found. Tthe average for the ‘with’ and ‘without 5g’ is here, the median value and the maximum, you can see they’re all higher, but this is giving a slightly misleading version because it’s in a log scale [00:12:25] Here you can see it in a linear scale. And so when we look at the maximum values in a community that has 5g millimeter waves activated, the levels are much, much higher than they are, you know, two streets over without millimeter waves. And if we look at the statistics for this, we find that the average is three times higher with 5g, two times higher for the median and five times higher for the maximum value on a street. So anyone who’s living on those streets or working on those streets is being exposed to extremely high levels of radio frequency radiation. [00:13:03] Angela Tsiang and I decided to ask the question, is there a connection between 5g and COVID and we went to the data and you can see here, the COVID maps for the US and for other countries, and then you can see here, the 5g global deployment, and there’s quite a bit of overlap. [00:13:27] So for example, in Africa, there’s very little radio frequency radiation compared to places like Europe and north America. And there’s very little COVID and very little 5g. And if you look at the United States, you can see once again, where levels of 5g have been deployed, the COVID levels are actually much higher as well. [00:13:51] And so we had this publications peer reviewed, and I’m just going to share with you some of the information that we got. We found that if you compare with millimeter wave technology and without 5g millimeter wave technology, there’s a difference in population. They’re putting 5g in primarily in larger communities, so there’s a statistically significant difference here in state population. There’s a relationship between what we call the millimeter wave index. And this is just an index as to how many distributors they have in the states, in some cases only Verizon, and in some cases it’s Verizon, AT&T and you know, several others. [00:14:35] So we use that to give us a rough estimate of what the millimeter waves would be. And there is a statistically significant relationship between that and COVID. We looked at air quality index and found there was a slight relationship that didn’t hold up all the time. When it comes to the number of tests per million people there was no difference with, and without 5g cases, states. When we looked at cases per million, there was a difference, and it was different by about a factor of two. So there were twice as many cases per million compared in 5G states, compared to states without 5g. And then we looked at the death rate and we found that that was even higher; that was statistically significant. And we had 126 on average deaths per million compared to 55 without the millimeter waves. And that was greater than a factor of two. We looked at the percentage of cases per test, found there was a difference here as well. And the number of deaths per test was different as well. [00:15:45] And then the percentage of deaths per cases was not statistically significant. So in areas where millimeter waves have been deployed, the number of cases per million and the number of deaths per million was much higher and it was statistically significant. And here’s another way of showing it. These were the states without 5g and this line represents the average which is 3,220, and when we look at the ratio of that to the millimeter waves we find that it’s 1.79. So when we’re looking at cases and here, when we’re looking at deaths, once again, there’s a big difference with many more deaths associated with 5g millimeter wave technology. [00:16:32] The other thing that people need to realize is that the symptoms of COVID and the symptoms of electro hypersensitivity are really quite similar. You can see here is that these are all of the symptoms that are in common with both and the COVID is represented by the black. So a hundred percent of the COVID-19 patients experience fatigue. When it comes to percentage of patients with electro hypersensitivity, about 88% of them experienced fatigue. [00:17:07] And so these are all symptoms that they seem to have in common. And Dr. Beverly Rubik and Dr. Rob Brown published this paper ‘Evidence for connection between Coronavirus disease 19 and exposure to radio frequency radiation from wireless communications, including 5g’. And this paper just came out in September of 2021, so it’s relatively new. [00:17:35] Now what I wanted to do is just bring your attention to a number of different websites. This is our global EMF network. We’re still looking for volunteers to do monitoring for us. My website here is on the harmful effects of electromagnetic fields. We have The Rose Lab, and this is dealing with beneficial effects of electromagnetic fields because not all frequencies are harmful. [00:18:01] And we have the zoryglaser.com website, which is historic documents. And then there’s the electro sensitive society that has helping people who are electrically hypersensitive. [00:18:15] Now, if you don’t live in the United States and you want to know what the levels, where 5G is, where 4g LTE is, then you can go to this particular website and it will show you all the 5g that is available and you can even go to other parts of this website and it’ll show you where 4g is and you can zero in and find out even more information. So we now have evidence that when millimeter waves are introduced, when the small cells are introduced into communities, the levels of radiation go up quite substantially. [00:18:54] In addition to New York, we did the same thing in Denver, Colorado, and found virtually the same thing. Parallel streets where the 5g has been introduced to one street, but not the other and the levels are much, much higher with the 5g millimeter wave technology introduced, even though we’re not measuring the millimeter waves, we’re just measuring the sub eight gigahertz frequencies. [00:19:16] So what we’ve learned from this is that the more antennas they’re going to deploy with millimeter waves, the higher, the levels of radiation and the more people who are going to become ill. W e’d like to invite others to join our global EMF network, if you’re interested, to continue adding data to this data set and that information is publicly available to anyone who wants to download it, look at it and contribute to it. So thank you very much. [00:19:47] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: Magda, that was an amazing talk. Thank you very much. And you’ve addressed questions that have been coming up in the newsroom and in the chat here. I think a lot of people would really like to participate in your investigation. This is amazing. And if you would do me a favor, I know you put it on your slides and we will make your slides available. [00:20:05] Dr. Magda Havas: I’ll make all my slides available to you. [00:20:07] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: Thank you. That’s amazing. And if you can put in the chat here and we will post it in the newsroom too, the websites that you put up there, so people can, cause I think everyone’s getting quite excited about this after hearing your talk. I have to say your international investigation of 5g is probably the most important identifier of levels of 5g in real time. Really is amazing. Thank you for bringing this information forward to share with everyone to learn about. This information is important for people to use when addressing concerns within their communities and beyond. So it’s really amazing. Thank you very much. Now there was a question that I think a few people have asked now is ‘how do they identify the towers that are going up in their community?’ [00:20:51] Dr. Magda Havas: They’re usually fairly small white boxes about that size that go up on streetlamps, all sorts of things. So that’s one way that you can, you can recognize them. And if you go on the internet and simply put in small cell antennas, it’ll show you what they look like under images. So you should be able to identify them quite easily. [00:21:12] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: Is there anywhere that you can go that actually shows where they’re intending to put them, that is there anywhere that you can see ahead of time, more active than reactive, it would be kind of nice. [00:21:22] Dr. Magda Havas: Yeah. I, I don’t know if they’re putting up anything prior to it, I think that would alert people and it would get them up in arms. So the fact that Verizon actually shows us which streets have millimeter wave technology, is I’m stunned that they did that, but it’s to our advantage that they did, because now we can do much more specific testing rather than on a whole state, we can actually compare streets you know, that have the millimeter wave technology. [00:21:50] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: No this is very helpful. And thank you so much. And over to you, David. [00:21:53] David Charalambous: Thank you, Magda for another brilliant presentation, we’ve got a number of questions and I’ll just read them out one by one that you can give your advice on. One of the questions actually that’s come up quite a number of times. Is, ‘are there any safe frequencies?’ [00:22:07] Dr. Magda Havas: Well, first of all, there are safe frequencies but they’re not being used for wireless, some of the research I do is looking at pulse electromagnetic field therapy and when, when I was first introduced to this therapy, I was actually very skeptical, that it did what it said it was supposed to do. And I was skeptical that people who were electrically hypersensitive could benefit from it. So I didn’t think it worked for one thing. And then I didn’t think people who were sensitive could tolerate being exposed. [00:22:37] But one of the things we found is that the pulsed electromagnetic frequencies do actually work. They’re normally much lower, they’re not in the radio frequency range, they’re in the, you know, extremely low frequency range, by and large. They vary from technology to technology. But they do a number of phenomenal things. They reduce pain, they’re being used in clinics all over the world, they reduce inflammation, they promote circulation of your blood, they prevent rouleaux formation, which is something that I have a problem with my blood goes into rouleaux and it becomes, you know, the cells stick together and so I’m not getting as much oxygen and not getting rid of the waste products as a result when I’m exposed to the technology. So we have evidence for that, that it’s doing all those things, but it’s not something that can be used for wireless because it doesn’t radiate, it’s, it’s just a lower frequency. [00:23:29] Could they make wireless technology safer by using safer frequencies? , I think the answer to that is yes and the reason I say that is the frequency they use for wifi and for microwave ovens and for a lot of technology that you have in your home is 2.45 gigahertz and 5 gigahertz, so they’re using two different frequency bands, and the reason they use those is they’re free. You don’t have to have a license in order to turn on your microwave oven or to turn on your wifi. Whereas if you’re a cell phone provider, you have to have a license for that frequency band you’re going to share with your clients. [00:24:10] The 2.45 gigahertz is the optimal frequency for heating for water absorption, for water, absorbing microwave radiation. And that’s why your microwave oven works. It’s absorbed by the water, the water starts vibrating, it creates heat, you know, it’s oscillating, it creates heat. And so it heats your baked potato from the inside out. [00:24:33] And so you can only put things in a microwave oven that are wet in order to get the effect. Dry rice won’t get heated up or anything, it’ll just stay raw. And so by using that frequency, that’s optimally absorbed by water is about the worst thing that you can do because we’re full of water. [00:24:53] And so we’re absorbing that, that frequency. So if they simply shifted it to something where you don’t have optimum water absorption, I think it would be safer. When it comes to the millimeter waves, I know they’re also being used by the military as an active denial system. And one of the frequencies within that millimeter range is 60 gigahertz. And 60 gigahertz is the optimal frequency for oxygen absorbing microwave radiation. [00:25:26] And so, if you’re exposed to 60 gigahertz and it’s penetrating deeply enough into your body that it affects your blood vessels and it’s binding to the oxygen, or if the oxygen is absorbing it, it could very well change the, the vibration of the oxygen and make it more difficult for it to bring the oxygen through the blood vessels, into your body because of that. [00:25:52] So they could definitely try different frequencies that I think would be healthier but not necessarily healthy, but perhaps not as harmful. [00:26:02] David Charalambous: Thank you, Magda. And another question, so mobile phones are such an essential part of our lives, what is the critical range of exposure? And I think that’s going to be a very difficult thing to answer, isn’t it, so what would be your thoughts around there? [00:26:17] Dr. Magda Havas: My attitude is that, if it’s the only thing that needs to be wireless, are mobile devices. And so what we’re doing is we’re making, you know, wireless is the new sexy gimmick to sell things. And so they’re making a lot of things wireless, which simply increases our exposure in the home. But if the only thing we were exposed to were mobile phones or mobile devices that used a microwave radiation, the levels would be much, much lower than they are currently. So things like wifi can be, you can turn on an ethernet cable, for example, or broadband over power lines, there’s ways of preventing, you know, wireless internet access. You can do it by wired. When it comes to smart meters, they have to be wired. I mean, it’s ridiculous, smart meters, aren’t going anywhere. And so whether it’s a smart meter for gas electricity or water, it should be wired. And so if we wired everything, except the mobile devices, our levels would be much, much lower and fewer people would be ill as a result. [00:27:24] Now, what levels are safe? Most scientists agree that there are no safe levels for radio frequency radiation. And so the less you’re absorbing the better. So the lower your exposure, the better and the shorter, your exposure, the better. And so as Pri and other people have said, you know, simply turning your cell phone off when you’re not using it, put it in airplane mode, turn everything else off when you don’t need it. And that will minimize your exposure and you should be able to tolerate it much better for much longer without the symptoms that people who are electrically hypersensitive have, or without the cancers as well. [00:28:01] David Charalambous: Thank you. We’ve heard a number of questions around resources, and I think it’s probably best we can put together a list from all of our speakers and we can post that and telegram groups for everyone. [00:28:14] There’s a question here that says ‘can EMF, and I know the answer to this, but I’m interested to hear, so can EMF interfere in some people with their sleep?’ [00:28:24] Dr. Magda Havas: Oh definitely. It’s one of the top things; headaches and sleep disturbances are two of the top things that people complain about. Also, difficulty concentrating, a foggy brain, that sort of thing. And what I recommend to people, if you think you’re, you might be sensitive turn everything off in your house, you know, unplug the electricity to your bedroom you know, turn off all your wireless technology and see what happens. See if it improves your sleep. Or, you know, if you’re traveling somewhere and you’re in an environment where the levels are much lower, see if you end up sleeping better. And most people who do that find that within one or two days, their sleep has improved dramatically. And then when they turn it back on, they can’t sleep as well again. [00:29:10] And sleep is absolutely critical for your health, that’s when our body’s healing itself. And so if you don’t get a good night’s sleep, ultimately it’s just going to be your health downfall. So sleep is absolutely critical. [00:29:23] David Charalambous: I mean, I know that one of the things we often won’t do, we won’t really attribute what we’re experiencing to wireless. I mean like a lot of things. We’re told these things are safe, but I think, well I’ve certainly had the experience when I talked to people, and they say they can’t sleep, I tell them to turn their wifi off and their mobile phone off at night, and then it makes a huge difference. Like I think when people experience it, it’s completely different from being told it, isn’t it. [00:29:51] Another question here Magda was with illness and I have seen a presentation that you did on something related to this where it said, can illness data be overlaid over to EMF maps as well? I remember watching one of your presentations, where you were visiting a lady’s house to measure it, and everyone in the corner block had had illness, hadn’t they? [00:30:11] Dr. Magda Havas: Oh yeah. We’ve actually done quite a few like that. One of the testings we did was in an apartment building. I think it was Pri who mentioned it with Lennart Hardell that when they had antennas on top of the building, the people immediately underneath were really sick and we found exactly the same thing. And they had to move. And, you know, if you’re going to put antennas on top of building, not something I would recommend, but if you’re going to do that, simply shield the, the entire roof so that it’s not going part of it’s going down, most of it is being projected out, but part of it is going down. [00:30:48] And so if you just shielded that you’d be protecting those people and they wouldn’t be exposed. So, you know, If the industry was forced to make these changes, they would. So I actually don’t blame the wireless industry. They’re just following guidelines and recommendations by the government. It’s the governments that aren’t doing their job. They’re the ones that are setting absolutely ridiculous guidelines, in most cases. They’re not enforcing them, you know, they’re really in bed with the telecom industry. And they’re the ones who I think should be legally sued for what is allowed to happen. And, you know, once they played along, if they played ball properly the industry would follow suit, they’d reduce their exposures. We don’t have to be as high as they are right now. They’ve reduced the exposures and once again, it would just benefit everyone. [00:31:39] David Charalambous: Absolutely. We have a question here. That’s very key actually. And I think, I mean, I, my background I can add maybe a little bit to begin with, but it’s a question that comes up all the time and it’s really; How can decision-makers, project companies, employees, et cetera, support 5g technology as no one’s going to be immune from the negative effects?’ And they ask, ‘is it just the lack of information?’ But I think in behavioral sciences, a couple of things here. And one of them is willful seeing and the other one is willfull ignorance that we often see what we want to see and certainly it’s been my experience that when, you know, people talk about this, they say, oh my cousin’s you know, a physicist and he says, it’s totally safe. And what happens is they get given a conclusion; ‘oh this is safe, you don’t have to worry’ and they don’t tend to look into the details do they Magda has been your experience that similar? [00:32:28] Dr. Magda Havas: Yeah, totally. I’ve actually decided that I don’t care what people think. I’m not trying to convince anyone. You know, if I’m giving a talk and someone says, well, I don’t believe this is harmful, I said, that’s fine, you don’t have to, you know, believe what you want to, you know, that’s your prerogative and so many people have a closed mind and I’m not trying to open their mind. I don’t really care. But once you’re curious, once you’ve been affected, then you know there’s something going on and then you’re craving for information. And it’s those people that I share the information with and they can take whatever is a value to them and then leave the rest. [00:33:06] Dr. Pri Bandara: Could I just take a moment to compliment what Magda said. I think, just to see how important what we are doing is my personal case. in March of 2012, a friend shared with me an email, a video made by Magda. And I had didn’t know anything about this Dr. Havas from Canada, but I just happened to see this video and it was really well done with its scientific studies, short review warning parents and the public about the risks of wireless radiation. And it incited curiosity in me, mainly because I had a history of getting headaches from mobile phone use, and I thought, oh, I need to look into this. [00:33:59] And so I had a chat with my husband and we organized a technician to come and measure the electromagnetic fields, including radio frequency at our home with two young kids, and then we found we had very, very high, you know, it was like, you know, the chap said your bedroom is like a microwave oven because we had a baby monitor and a cordless phone. [00:34:26] And they were like irradiating the environment 24/7 with very high levels of microwave radiation. And because I was now looking into the scientific studies and realizing that there’s something here and we thought, okay, we are going to wire the home, got rid of everything wireless and dropped the the radio frequency levels, you know, sleeping area by 9,000 times. [00:34:57] And simply by replacing those two, you know, getting rid of the baby monitor and having a wired phone and What happened, like, I have to admit, I did it expecting to see nothing to observe nothing. I mean, after all, I was a clinical researcher who had done research with patients for years and years. [00:35:20] And, you know, you don’t see a drastic results, but I just did it to be on the safe side. And we aren’t, we weren’t certainly luddites who were scared of technology. Not at all. My husband was a robotics engineer. So, you know, suddenly we were, you know, a tech savvy people, but it’s just, you know, out of curiosity, you know, with an open mind, you know, we did that. [00:35:47] What happened in the next weeks and months was the most, I would say the most life-changing experience, for me personally and particularly my youngest son who was five at the time who had a really difficult time, you know, first four years of well, quite nearly five years. So having multiple neuro immune conditions and serious sleep disruption, this child was so unhappy, so unsettled and it affected our life. He clearly had ADHD, although we hadn’t sought a clinical diagnosis. Practically, that was the course that I had actually stopped working because that child was so unwell and unsettled. We had held him back from school because of his health issues. He started sleeping and he started behaving normally like a normal, and I remember one day calling my husband and saying, you know, can you believe the little one was sitting down and coloring something for 40 minutes and he can probably go to school. It was life changing. And what was really incredible was his very itchy eczema resolved. And it was at a time that winter was setting and we normally get worsening. So this was against what was supposed to happen. [00:37:09] For 12 months I took photos, kept records and you know, we, I got myself trained in measurement and did everything. And I realized if this was happening to my child, the son of a medical researcher mom, who knew so much about things, you know, all about health, then what about the fate of children who, you know, millions and millions out there who are immersed in this technology? [00:37:39] And I, I realized that, you know what Magda did really changed my life, my child’s life and our family life. And I thought, I can’t turn my back to this issue, so I became focused on this, this area of research. So Magda, thank you so much. This is the first time that we are sharing, you know, we are presenting together and it’s a great pleasure because it is really, you know, I thank you for what you did, you know, against the, the forces, trying to suppress the science, you went out of your way and it’s certainly changed, you know, change lives, it’s amazing what we can do with an open mind and a bit of curiosity. [00:38:22] Dr. Magda Havas: That’s really beautiful. Thank you. [00:38:25] David Charalambous: That’s a brilliant touching story Pri. And I think what’s really interesting when Magda, when you were talking about changing minds, it’s really fascinating. The human mind is very much like the human egg. Once the human egg’s got the sperm, then it shuts off to anything new. And that’s what a lot of the time the human mind does. But experience changes. Once you experienced something and obviously Pri, you had the experience and so many people in the campaign is that I spoke to and Karen spoke to have had a personal experience. You know, someone’s been ill and then someone’s recovered and that’s what makes it really powerful. And I think also when we look at history, you know, for so long, we were told cigarettes were safe, asbestos is safe, all these things for many, many, many years. And once it, you know, the information really got out there, everything shifted didn’t it. [00:39:12] So, thank you all, Jennifer, did you want to add anything? [00:39:15] Dr. Jennifer Hibberd: Thank you for calling me in. Yes, it would be my pleasure. I actually got this quote from Magda and it’s on your website and it said, ‘once you become fearless, life becomes limitless’. And I thought that that was just so beautiful and it’s so true with everything we experience in life, always. [00:39:34] I mean, most notably now, but in every day and every moment of your life it’s life-changing and what you bring forward and bringing out the reality of what’s around us, that we can see all can’t see, enables us cause what, you know, you can deal with. And to everybody out there very much, the message is get involved, engage with our leaders here and in doing so we can create a better way together. [00:40:01] And thank you so much, Karen, Magda and Pri for your leadership and all of this phenomenal information. I think you have really engaged people so beautifully. We will share this and we will talk more and more about this together, and I really appreciate you being here today. Thank you. [00:40:18]